My yesterday mail was intended to raise comments, and this definitely
works (even if people felt offensed rather than only requested for
The second point made unanimity about the absence of conflict of interest
and the benefit of the constituency to have ICANNwatch as member.
OK for me (I got the answer I asked for).
Concerning the first point, either the charter is not accurate enough, or
the topic is too close from the IDN.
Regarding the one man business constituency membership, the comparison is
not completely adequate. To run a business (even a one man business), one
need to be registered as business (IRS and also some kind of professional
register, depending the local law). That makes a true difference with
IDNH. Since the non-commercial nature of our constituency, this criteria
is not existing and it is difficult to make any difference between the
current application and an IDN application, whatever the content of the
By answering separately to MM, I asked to the charter revision subgroup
(MM is part of it) to review the definition of the world "organisation"
and check whether it was adequately defined or not, for further similar
On Mon, 18 Sep 2000, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote:
> The first point, minimum size, is certainly a potentially valid one if > this is a neutral criteria consistently applied to other groups. You > would know better than I if this is the case. Is there some document you > point me to which discusses this issue? How big is 'big enough'? I have > not followed all the detailed discussions of membership criteria in the > past. > > Armed with some neutral criteria grounded in the materials you doubtlessly > will be providing soon, we can then try to measure the size of ICANNWatch. > The editorial management is only 3 people; there are however numerous > other participants of varying degree of intensity, including several doing > web support (you don't think law professors designed those pages, do > you?). Exactly how we decide who does and doesn't count may be difficult. > > I hope, however, it is obvious to you that: > > * ICANNWatch is real and not a sham of any sort, > > * that it has a genuine educational purpose, and > > * that it is also obvious that it wasn't created with joining the NCC in > mind, but for a valid and independent purpose. > > On the other hand, I find your proposed ideological test in the second > criteria to be, quite frankly, offensive in the extreme. Since when is > membership in ICANN organizations overtly limited to those with particular > points of view? > > On Mon, 18 Sep 2000, Dany Vandromme wrote: > > > To Michael > > > > I would not support this application without further explanation. At least > > I would raise two issues: > > > > 1) if two individuals decide to jointly maintain a web site, does that > > mean that they form an organisation? I personally maintains a couple of > > web sites with some colleagues or friends, or even with my son, but doing > > so, I did never consider that I was part of an organisation. > > > > > > 2) It may be some conflict of interest as follows: > > Becoming a member of a supporting organisation would mean to support > > ICANN. I feel that the mission or object of icannwatch, is not really to > > support ICANN. Obviously, you can argue that pointing out everything ICANN > > is doing differently from what you think it should do is a form of help, > > but anyway, it would certainly not be the most productive or efficient > > way. I would like to have more comments or feelings from you and > > from the constituency. > > > > Comments? > > > > DV > > - > > > > On Sun, 17 Sep 2000, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law wrote: > > > > > Apologies. Here goes a resend in ascii: > > > > > > Application of ICANNWatch.org for membership in the Non Commercial Domain > > > Name Holders Constituency. > > > > > > Submitted by David Post and Michael Froomkin. > > > > > > > > > A. Basic Information for Organization > > > > > > 1. What is the name of your Organization? > > > > > > ICANNWatch.org > > > > > > 2. Is the Organization a member of any other constituency in the > > > Domain Name Supporting Organization of ICANN? > > > > > > No. > > > > > > 3. What is the major domain name of the Organization? > > > > > > icannwatch.org > > > > > > 4. Does the Organization have a website and if so, would you > > > provide the URL? > > > > > > URL: www.icannwatch.org > > > > > > B. Contact information for Representative of Organization > > > > > > 1. What is your name and title with the Organization? > > > > > > David G. Post > > > Co-Director, ICANNWatch.org > > > > > > 2. How can other representatives reach you? (email, telephone, fax > > > appreciated) > > > > > > email Postd@erols.com > > > Phone 202 364 5010 or 215 204 4539 > > > Fax 215 204 1185 > > > > > > 3. How is it that you have come to represent the Organization in > > > thisConstituency? (Please furnish appropriate indication that the > > > Organization has authorized your participation, for example, vote of > > > membership, vote of directors, action by officer(s) or consensus of > > > members.) > > > > > > ICANNWatch was formed by three people: Prof. David Post of Temple > > > University Law School, Professor Michael Froomkin of the University of > > > Miami, and Professor David Farber of the University of Pennsylvania. > > > Prof. Farber has taken a position as Chief Technologist at the Federal > > > Communications Commission; in light of that, he has withdrawn from any > > > affiliation with ICANNWatch. Prof. Froomkin and I therefore speak for the > > > organization and can represent it in all matters. > > > > > > 4. Are there other representatives from your Organization who will > > > be participating in this Constituency? Is so, who is authorized to vote > > > on behalf of the Organization? > > > > > > Professors David Post and Michael Froomkin each is authorized to > > > vote on behalf of the organization. > > > > > > C. Purpose of Organization: > > > > > > 1. What are the Organization's primary activities? > > > 2. What are the Organization's primary activities on the Internet? > > > > > > ICANNWatch's primary activity is maintenance of the website at > > > www.icannwatch.org. The website serves as a forum for informed and > > > unbiased discussion of issues surrounding ICANN's maintenance of the > > > domain name system. > > > > > > 3. Please furnish a statement of how the Organization's purposes > > > and activities conform to the NCDNHC Constituency's goals and membership > > > requirements. This should be a narrative statement which specifically > > > describes the Organization's purposes and activities and may include > > > references to charter or by-law provisions. > > > > > > ICANNWatch was formed in 1998 in order to provide a place for > > > informed commentary about ICANN's activities. At the time ICANNWatch was > > > founded, there was virtually no public discussion of these issues, and, on > > > the theory that `sunlight is the best disinfectant,' we felt (and continue > > > to feel) that public discussion and debate is indispensable if ICANN is to > > > define and to fulfill its mission. The ICANNWatch mission statement is as > > > follows: > > > > > > Our premise can be simply stated: The Internet is a global resource of > > > incalculable value, and nothing is of greater importance to its future > > > than the way in which ICANN performs its role as manager of the Domain > > > Name System. All Internet users worldwide have a stake in these ongoing > > > events, and our job is to serve as a central point of reference, a kind of > > > hill overlooking the often-chaotic information landscape, from which > > > anyone seeking a better understanding of these developments can survey the > > > ever-changing terrain. > > > We have no particular viewpoint to push or > > > axes to grind; we will offer commentary and criticism from a wide variety > > > of different perspectives, guided only by our belief in the power of ideas > > > and informed discussion and debate to shape events and institutions. > > > > > > [http://www.icannwatch.org/mission/] > > > > > > D. Type of Organization: > > > > > > Please furnish information regarding your Organization's > > > legal status -- is it incorporated (if so, in what jurisdiction) or > > > unincorporated? If incorporated, doe it have a not-for-profit or > > > non-commercial status? > > > > > > ICANNWatch is an unincorporated association. > > > > > > E. Size of Organization: > > > > > > The NCDNHC will have two subgroups: one for Large and the > > > other for Small Organizations. Please indicate the category of membership > > > or employee size. If the Organization has both members and employees, > > > please answer both questions. > > > > > > 1. Are you a membership organization? If so, does the > > > Organization have under or over 1000 members? What type of individuals or > > > entities are members of your Organization? > > > > > > 2. If you are a non-member organization, do you have > > > underor over 200 employees? > > > > > > ICANNWatch is not a membership organization, nor does it have more > > > than 200 employees. > > > > > > F. Conflict of Interest > > > > > > Note: Conflict of Interest may or may not be a bar to joining the NCDNHC. > > > The hope is that by circulating information about our views, backgrounds, > > > and possible conflicts of interests, others in the NCDNHC will have a > > > better idea how to interpret and weigh the ideas that we put forward. > > > > > > 1. For the Organization: > > > > > > Please furnish a brief statement concerning any possible > > > conflict between the goals of the Constituency and the Organization's > > > purposes,functions or activities. > > > > > > Both Professors Froomkin and Post are Co-Directors of disputes.org > > > (see http://www.disputes.org), an online dispute resolution service > > > provider that has entered into a Consortium with eResolution.ca to provide > > > domain name dispute resolution services under ICANN's Uniform Dispute > > > Resolution Policy (UDRP). Although we do not believe that this conflicts > > > in any way with the NCDNHC's goals or purposes, we do understand and > > > endorse the need to be as forthcoming about the appearance of conflicts of > > > interest as possible. > > > > > > Has the Organization been involved in Internet governance before? > > > Does it have any developed positions that you would like others to know > > > about? If so, please describe below or provide a URL. > > > > > > See the material posted at http://www.icannwatch.org > > > > > > 2. For the Representative: > > > > > > As individuals, many of us have been involved in Internet > > > governance before. If you have any positions on Internet governance that > > > you would like others to read about (taken on behalf of this Organization > > > or others or as an individual), please feel free to tell us about them or > > > drop a URL below. > > > > > > H. To submit this membership form, you must send the above information to > > > NCDNHC-Application@LYRIS.ISOC.ORG. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, 17 Sep 2000, Kent Crispin wrote: > > > > > > > Do you think you could put it in a readable form? > > > > > > -- > > > Please visit http://www.icannwatch.org > > > A. Michael Froomkin | Professor of Law | firstname.lastname@example.org > > > U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA > > > +1 (305) 284-4285 | +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax) | http://www.law.tm > > > -->It's humid here.<-- > > > > > > > > > --- > > > You are currently subscribed to ncdnhc-discuss as: email@example.com > > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-ncdnhc-discuss-2019V@lyris.isoc.org > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Dany VANDROMME | Directeur du GIP RENATER > > > > Reseau National de Telecommunications > > pour la Technologie, l'Enseignement et la Recherche > > > > | ENSAM > > Tel : +33 (0)1 53 94 20 30 | 151 Boulevard de l'Hopital > > Fax : +33 (0)1 53 94 20 31 | 75013 Paris > > E-mail: Dany.Vandromme@renater.fr | FRANCE > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > -- > Please visit http://www.icannwatch.org > A. Michael Froomkin | Professor of Law | firstname.lastname@example.org > U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA > +1 (305) 284-4285 | +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax) | http://www.law.tm > -->It's humid here.<-- > > >
------------------------------------------------------------------- Dany VANDROMME | Directeur du GIP RENATER
Reseau National de Telecommunications pour la Technologie, l'Enseignement et la Recherche
| ENSAM Tel : +33 (0)1 53 94 20 30 | 151 Boulevard de l'Hopital Fax : +33 (0)1 53 94 20 31 | 75013 Paris E-mail: Dany.Vandromme@renater.fr | FRANCE --------------------------------------------------------------------
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